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F3-10666CL9D-8GBSQ & Thinkpad W510

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  • F3-10666CL9D-8GBSQ & Thinkpad W510

    My 4Gx2 set (F3-10666CL9D-8GBSQ) seems have some compatibility issues with Thinkpad W510.

    Symptoms:
    Random app crashes and BSoD.


    System config:
    Thinkpad W510 4389-CTO,
    I7 720qm,
    Motherboard Chipset: Intel QM57 (IbexPeak-M DO)
    Quadro Fx880m,
    The latest bios (1.34),
    Windows 7 Pro with all the updates and the latest drivers,
    4Gx2 installed in the first and third slot to form dual channel.

    Mem info:
    General information
    Total Memory Size: 8 GBytes

    Current Performance Settings
    Maximum Supported Memory Clock: 666.7 MHz (5 : 1 ratio)
    Current Memory Clock: 1818.2 MHz (5 : 1 ratio)
    Current Timing (tCAS-tRCD-tRP-tRAS): 9.0-9-9-24
    Memory Runs At: Dual-Channel

    Command Rate: 1T
    Read to Read Delay (tRD_RD) Same Rank: 4T
    Read to Read Delay (tRD_RD) Different Rank: 6T
    Read to Read Delay (tRD_RD) Different DIMM: 7T
    Write to Write Delay (tWR_WR) Same Rank: 4T
    Write to Write Delay (tWR_WR) Different Rank: 7T
    Write to Write Delay (tWR_WR) Different DIMM: 7T
    Read to Write Delay (tRD_WR) Same Rank: 10T
    Read to Write Delay (tRD_WR) Different Rank: 10T
    Read to Write Delay (tRD_WR) Different DIMM: 10T
    Write to Read Delay (tWR_RD) Same Rank (tWTR): 16T
    Write to Read Delay (tWR_RD) Different Rank: 5T
    Write to Read Delay (tWR_RD) Different DIMM: 5T
    Read to Precharge Delay (tRTP): 5T
    Write to Precharge Delay (tWTP/tWR): 21T
    RAS# to RAS# Delay (tRRD): 4T
    Refresh Cycle Time (tRFC): 107T
    Four Activate Window (tFAW): 20T


    Module 0 info
    General Module Information
    Module Number: 0
    Module Size: 4096 MBytes
    Memory Type: DDR3 SDRAM
    Module Type: SO-DIMM
    Memory Speed: 666.7 MHz (PC3-10600)
    Module Manufacturer: G Skill
    Module Part Number: F3-10666CL9-4GBSQ
    Module Revision: 0
    Module Serial Number: 0
    Module Manufacturing Date: Year: 2000, Week: 0
    Module Manufacturing Location: 0
    SDRAM Manufacturer: Unknown
    Error Check/Correction: None

    Module characteristics
    Row Address Bits: 15
    Column Address Bits: 10
    Number Of Banks: 8
    Module Density: 2048 Mb
    Number Of Ranks: 2
    Device Width: 8 bits
    Bus Width: 64 bits
    Module Nominal Voltage (VDD): 1.5 V

    Module timing
    Minimum SDRAM Cycle Time (tCKmin): 1.500 ns
    CAS# Latencies Supported: 6, 7, 8, 9
    Minimum CAS# Latency Time (tAAmin): 13.125 ns
    Minimum RAS# to CAS# Delay (tRCDmin): 13.125 ns
    Minimum Row Precharge Time (tRPmin): 13.125 ns
    Minimum Active to Precharge Time (tRASmin): 36.000 ns

    Supported Module Timing at 666.7 MHz: 9-9-9-24
    Supported Module Timing at 533.3 MHz: 7-7-7-20
    Supported Module Timing at 400.0 MHz: 6-6-6-15

    Minimum Write Recovery Time (tWRmin): 15.000 ns
    Minimum Row Active to Row Active Delay (tRRDmin): 6.000 ns
    Minimum Active to Active/Refresh Time (tRCmin): 49.125 ns
    Minimum Refresh Recovery Time Delay (tRFCmin): 160.000 ns
    Minimum Internal Write to Read Command Delay (tWTRmin): 7.500 ns
    Minimum Internal Read to Precharge Command Delay (tRTPmin): 7.500 ns
    Minimum Four Activate Window Delay Time (tFAWmin): 30.000 ns

    Features
    On-die Thermal Sensor (ODTS) Readout: Not Supported
    Auto Self Refresh (ASR): Not Supported
    Extended Temperature Refresh Rate: Not Supported
    Extended Temperature Range: Supported
    Module Temperature Sensor: Not Supported
    Module Nominal Height: 29 - 30 mm
    Module Maximum Thickness (Front): 1 - 2 mm
    Module Maximum Thickness (Back): 1 - 2 mm

    Module 1 info are largely the same.

    Other info:
    I ran 20 passes of extended Windows Memory diagnostic and found no problem. So it means the modules are not likely to be defective under normal operation conditions. Right?

  • #2
    Change the CR (Command Rate) to 2


    Pls offer comments on support I provide, HERE, in order to help me do a better job here:

    Tman

    Comment


    • #3
      Unable to. Bios does have such an option. 1T command rate seems hard-wired into the laptop. What alternatives do I have?

      Comment


      • #4
        Can you adjust timings or voltages? Don't have a manual immediately handy, can pull off later this PM or if GSkill shows they may have one or already know


        Pls offer comments on support I provide, HERE, in order to help me do a better job here:

        Tman

        Comment


        • #5
          No. Neither timing nor voltage. The only mem-related option my bios has is whether to run an extended mem test at the power up.

          I have a conspiracy theory: lenovo locks the command rate to 1T so that most CR=2 after-market ram will become incompatible and we would have to buy their own "certified" modules which costs ~$400


          "Lenovo 4GB PC3-8500 1066Mhz DDR3 SODIMM Memory
          51J0493
          Web Price $449.95 *"

          Lenovo SODIMM? Lenovo SODOMY is more like it
          Last edited by simulink; 12-07-2010, 12:27 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Most DRAM tends to work best at CR 2, but your right laptop makers in particular tune the BIOS to keep third party vendors from selling add ons and upgrades - some desktop makers still do also i.e. Dell...Could drop them a line and complain about it...if nothing else a little peace of mind from griping, I do it all the time


            Pls offer comments on support I provide, HERE, in order to help me do a better job here:

            Tman

            Comment


            • #7
              It appears they do this so they can sell their high density memory at a higher price. Consequently, the more standard low density memory will not work properly. More companies will do this so they can sell their $500 memory.

              So the key is, 4GB modules that have 4 large chips on each side should be compatible. Samsung makes this I know.

              Thank you
              GSKILL TECH

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks for the pointer to high density modules.

                Indeed the official Lenovo 4G modules are high density ones (4 chips) OEM-ed by Samsung. Also Kingston (KTL-TP3B/4G), CORSAIR and Mushkin also have such high-den 4G modules. However judging from the Newegg reviews, those sold on the retail market have a high rate of DoA.

                It is a pity that GSkill seems not interested/involved in this niche market. I can't seem to find a similar module by GSkill.

                P.S. I did a test of the GSkill modules on a different laptop with CR=2T and a higher TRFC and they worked fine. Clearly the modules are not defective, but just incompatible with W510.


                Originally posted by GSKILL TECH View Post
                It appears they do this so they can sell their high density memory at a higher price. Consequently, the more standard low density memory will not work properly. More companies will do this so they can sell their $500 memory.

                So the key is, 4GB modules that have 4 large chips on each side should be compatible. Samsung makes this I know.

                Thank you
                GSKILL TECH

                Comment


                • #9
                  Many laptop makers more or less lock down the BIOS to ensure you come back to them for addons/upgrades....the use of proprietary parts also used to be a problem w/ some desktops, Compaq and Dell in particular where you almost HAD to go to them for DRAM and at times even other things like HDs


                  Pls offer comments on support I provide, HERE, in order to help me do a better job here:

                  Tman

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hello everyone,

                    I am just posting here to confirm that the G.Skill RAM model # F3-10666CL9D-8GBSQ works just fine now with the Lenovo W510 Laptop. I have loaded my W510 with 16GB?s of the above stated RAM (4 sticks of 4GBs).

                    I have stressed it a lot and still didn?t get any BSoD?s at all. As a matter of fact, I ran a RAMDisk on it and played games from the RAMDisk and it runs flawlessly. It gets about 3800 MBPS read and 4200 MBPS write (CrystalDiskMark Bench). It?s been perfect for video encoding and photo-shop scratch disk, very rapid and very responsive with minimal heat dissipation.

                    The latest BIOS from Lenovo (Version 1.37) supports 2T Command Rate (CR) and this RAM has been functioning very well so far. I?ve gotten 7.4 Windows Experience Index (Win 7 pro x64) once I installed this RAM (previously 5.9 with the Lenovo installed high density RAM).

                    Here are some system specs to check if your system matches mine:

                    Code:
                    Lenovo W510 4318CTO
                    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    
                    Processors Information
                    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    
                    Processor 1			ID = 0
                    	Number of cores		4 (max 8)
                    	Number of threads	8 (max 16)
                    	Name			Intel Core i7 920XM
                    	Codename		Clarksfield
                    	Specification		Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU       X 920  @ 2.00GHz
                    	Package (platform ID)	Socket 989 rPGA (0x4)
                    	CPUID			6.E.5
                    	Extended CPUID		6.1E
                    	Core Stepping		B1
                    	Technology		45 nm
                    	TDP Limit		55 Watts
                    	Core Speed		2507.1 MHz
                    	Multiplier x FSB	19.0 x 132.0 MHz
                    	Rated Bus speed		2375.2 MHz
                    	Stock frequency		2000 MHz
                    	Instructions sets	MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, SSE4.1, SSE4.2, EM64T, VT-x
                    	L1 Data cache		4 x 32 KBytes, 8-way set associative, 64-byte line size
                    	L1 Instruction cache	4 x 32 KBytes, 4-way set associative, 64-byte line size
                    	L2 cache		4 x 256 KBytes, 8-way set associative, 64-byte line size
                    	L3 cache		8 MBytes, 16-way set associative, 64-byte line size
                    	FID/VID Control		yes
                    
                    	Turbo Mode		supported, enabled
                    	Max turbo frequency	3200 MHz
                    	Max non-turbo ratio	15x
                    	Max turbo ratio		24x
                    	Max efficiency ratio	9x
                    	TDC Limit		47 Amps
                    	Core TDP		47 Watts
                    	Uncore TDP		8 Watts
                    	Power @ 9x		18 Watts
                    	Power @ 10x		21 Watts
                    	Power @ 11x		26 Watts
                    	Power @ 12x		32 Watts
                    	Power @ 13x		38 Watts
                    	Power @ 14x		46 Watts
                    	Power @ 15x		55 Watts
                    	Max bus number		255
                    	Attached device		PCI device at bus 255, device 2, function 1
                    	Attached device		PCI device at bus 255, device 3, function 4
                    	Attached device		PCI device at bus 255, device 2, function 1
                    
                    Chipset
                    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    
                    Northbridge			Intel DMI Host Bridge rev. 11
                    Southbridge			Intel QM57 rev. 06
                    Graphic Interface		PCI-Express
                    PCI-E Link Width		x16
                    PCI-E Max Link Width		x16
                    Memory Type			DDR3
                    Memory Size			16384 MBytes
                    Channels			Dual
                    Memory Frequency		659.8 MHz (2:10)
                    CAS# latency (CL)		9.0
                    RAS# to CAS# delay (tRCD)	9
                    RAS# Precharge (tRP)		9
                    Cycle Time (tRAS)		24
                    Row Refresh Cycle Time (tRFC)	107
                    Command Rate (CR)		2T
                    Uncore Frequency		2375.2 MHz
                    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    I hope this information has been helpful to those of you who own a W510 from Lenovo.

                    Regards,
                    Al.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thanks for the info


                      Pls offer comments on support I provide, HERE, in order to help me do a better job here:

                      Tman

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Not a problem!

                        Comment

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